The battle of the swings

On the one hand, we have Bryce Molder. Someone with an over the top swing according to Peter Kostis.

(It’s not technically over the top the way a terrible golfer is, but his downswing is above the backswing.)

It is “his” golf swing and he just won for the first time on Tour. He is far less talented than Tiger (or even me for that matter), he was patient, worked hard and kept his own swing without listening to dorks like Peter Kostis and everyone on Golfwrx who would tell him his swing was terrible because it was over the top, not in the slot and with no lag. Yes, I know he worked with PK.

Boy do I wish I was as smart as Bryce Molder…and kept my swing.

Then you have Tiger Woods. Someone who had his own swing, that was fine tuned by Butch Harmon, and dominated the Tour and the majors like they have never been dominated before.

Now he is using the swing of someone else and people are talking about how improved he is when he barley makes the cut and finishes 10 shots back in a fall season event that no one is playing in.

“It looks better”

“He needs more tournament time”

“His best golf is in front of him”

“He is more CP now than CF now and he needs time to get used to it”

(I don’t know what the heck that means. Sounds like there is something wrong with his colon after a high colonic of South American coffee)

Remember the other day when I said you need a minimum level of swing competence to play your best golf so you can focus on scoring????

Here is another quote, but this one is from me.

“His swing stinks and he is spending so much time trying to make it not stink, he is neglecting his short game and it stinks too.”

For those of you without relative meters, “stinks” is a relative term comparing Tiger 2000 and Tiger with the “Lean and Snatch” move. Heck, Tiger under Haney (and you know how much I liked that) would beat the lean and snatch like a red headed step child.

It is not a good swing for Tiger. Foley does well with Mahan and Rose, he has done poorly with Tiger.

Someone else made a great point in a thread about Tiger. He said it would be like Magic Johnson starting to shoot free throws like Larry Bird, because Bird’s stroke was more fundamentally sound…when Magic was in his prime and leading the league in free throws.

I kind of disagree with that. Tiger’s swing in 2000 was pretty fundamentally sound. It had some small issues if you are comparing it to the “arbitrary correct swing,” but did anything hold up under pressure better? What’s more fundamentally sound than that? A swing that holds up under major championship pressure.

Not this lean and snatch he is doing now, that’s for sure.

I find it ironic that in a week that Tiger barely made the cut using the new age “perfect swing,” someone with a “weekend golfer’s over the top move” was the guy who won.

For those of you that say that Tiger’s resume far exceeds both Bryce Molder’s and mine…you have made my point for me.

I disagree with those who say there is no hope for Tiger. I think there still is unless he stays with the lean and snatch…then there is no hope he will catch Nicklaus.

PS-I am not making fun of stack and tilt. I find Andy and Mike quite intelligent. They did what I am doing now. They figured out the information out there was crap and decided to figure out on their own what made more sense.

What Tiger is doing is not stack and tilt. It is lean and snatch. Lean on the left side during the takeaway and snatch the club to the ball with your arms.

Don’t like that?

OK, how’s this?

Too many spine angle changes in more directions than you can count and too much forced forward shaft lean with the hands.

Lean and Snatch. Make sense now?




  1. Wally

    Bryce Molder has no left pectoral muscle, and he was born with Poland syndrome. He has been fighting all his life. It was good to see a nice guy win. Congrtaulations Bryce Mulder

  2. woody

    “Too many spine angle changes”…?

    Spine angle is like swing plane. People see something from a deceptive video angle, and try to make it a goal. All spine angle does is tell you whether or not someone is getting out of their own way. If a golfer focuses on retaining spine angle, then he’s probably not going to wind-up his torso.

    When you turn, your spine turns too. As Mike Bennet said, “Your spine moves all over the place.”

    It’s just impossible to turn “around your spine,” even though it might look that way and feel fairly effortless if your swing includes getting out of your own way.

    Even if Tiger is only mediocre–possibly upper mediocre–that would still make him a world-class golfer, and on a random weekend he could still get lucky and put it together.

    In his final year in baseball, Willie Mays hit 10 doubles and 6 homers, and even stole a base…but he only batted .211 (lifetime .302). My point? It’s reasonable to expect a Tiger decline at some point.

    However, Foley seems to be rushing it ahead of schedule.

  3. Michael

    Monte, he did improve from Thursday’s round. I don’t care if he starts swinging left handed or like Moe Norman. What his swing needs is consistency. He looked like he started to have more of it from his Friday round on. The bigger thing I saw was he was hitting greens in regulation. Can’t remember his Friday round, but Saturday and Sunday were both 14/18. That’s back in line with his former self. He might see the light at the end of the tunnel now, it’s just undetermined how far away he is from it.

  4. Mike Z

    Aside from the lack of consistency in Tiger’s new swing, there was a subtle effect that I noticed yesterday. One of his great strengths as a player was in controlling his misses and rarely putting himself in a position to make bogey, keeping the ball below the hole, etc. Now, he seems to be hitting unpredictable misses and finding himself in the worst trouble on any given hole, which is leading to more bogeys than I’ve ever seen him make.

    Even if his short game was still 2005-good, he would still struggle to get up and down from some of the awful places he has been hitting it.

      • Mike Z

        Well, if I REALLY “got it”, I wouldn’t also be hitting such unpredictable misses myself…haha.

  5. Calvin

    It’s always been the thought in my crowd from watching Tiger’s career that the blood and guts effort he put into swinging would deplete him physically and lead to a too early decline. Palmer had a similar fate. Tiger could easily go to a mechanically fluid move and prolong his career but I don’t think it’s in his DNA. I think he gets uglier and uglier just like Arnie.

  6. Calvin

    β€œHe is more CP now than CF now and he needs time to get used to it”

    Centripetal Force (CP) swinging left of target
    Centrifugal Force (CF) swinging right of target

    Geez why don’t he swing at the target? No wonder people get confused
    about golf. He must be reading Homer. πŸ™‚

    • woody

      He does swing at the target…it’s the ball.

      As I understand it, bowlers don’t throw at the pins.

      Baseball players don’t swing at the stands.

      • Calvin

        Actually they do. They swing at the ball in a way that projects the stands or a line drive or a grounder. The bowler bowls to spot that projects the proper pin.

      • gwlee7

        I highest game I ever bowled (210), I was so drunk I couldn’t even see the pins. πŸ™‚

    • Monte Scheinblum

      Thanks Calvin, I knew what it was, I just like making fun of that stuff.

  7. Jason

    It’s what I’ve said a few times. Target focus, not ball focus. Make the ball blurry in your vision and watch the club blur on by, it’s like a practice swing with the ball “in the way”.


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