The irony of secondary tilt

…or spine tilt away from the target.

It may be the only thing in the swing that is almost universal among good players and you actually
have some direct control over it.

Long drivers and most long hitters on tour have what I believe is an excess of it.

Yet not only is it not discussed much, some people are endorsing getting rid of it.

Previous

Next

20 Comments

  1. Jake G

    Why do you think that some people are endorsing to get rid of the secondary tilt? Is it simply a misunderstanding of the golf swing?

    Reply
    • Monte Scheinblum

      People who look at the swing in 2D or fail to see the counter intuitive nature of the swing come up snake eyes.

      Covering the ball….?

      Reply
      • Jake G

        Good point Monte. I can see how if people were viewing an issue like you mentioned from face-on they might not perceive the problem to be lack of forward bend and instead blame secondary tilt. Once you look at the DTL view it is easy to see the real culprit though

        Reply
      • david carter

        Monte are you saying that the more side tilt you have on the downswing the more powerful and accurate the swing will be ?

        Reply
        • Monte Scheinblum

          Not ore, the right amount. Going to vary from person to person, but you have to have some. Upper body doesn’t move forward is the key.

          Reply
          • david carter

            So the key is just maintaining spine tilt away from the target and keeping the head relatively still is what creates a good transitions and the amount of lag your supposed to have?

  2. Steve P

    Monte – I know you go into this topic slightly in your new wedge video (which is fantastic as well the short game video), but are you planning on doing any other videos (or are any others out there) to help with feels, drills, etc for this type of tilt? Thanks in advance.

    Steve

    Reply
    • Jake G

      I will answer for Monte here Steve. I know he has plans of putting out more videos progressing to more of his full swing philosophy but for now he has a lot of really helpful stuff like this here on YouTube

      Hope this helps. Jake G

      Reply
  3. dogballz

    Struggling with finding this position, I recently stumbled upon some thoughts, that feel helpful for me in reducing upper body sway towards the target. I understand “feel is not real” and one should not force or zero-out positions.

    My revelation, involves the movements of the back knee and back foot (heel), which probably effect one another and consequently tilt. If you look at the natural athletic movements involving swinging or even throwing, you’ll see the back knee moving towards the target, followed by the back foot (heel) lifting (slightly in some cases, ie. golf).

    Search images of Roger Federer, Albert Puljos, Peyton Manning, and/or Rory McIlroy and you’ll see this action. It is more apparent with a wider stance, for example with the driver in golf.

    In my opinion, this is a natural movement. Try the “3 to 9” release drill with a golf club and you’ll naturally feel this movement. I believe the action is lessened with a shorter club (narrower stance) and the back foots rolls left more than lifts.

    Unfortunately, for us golfers, the ball is static, which gives us all the time to think where I should put this body part and that body part (ie, planting back foot). I believe Monte has mentioned the use of unrestricted movements. In my opinion, allowing naturally the movement of the back knee/foot (heel) to move towards the target and it’s “tilt city”.

    I know what you’re thinking, but it’s not hanging back, if the weight transitions left to start the downswing.

    This is the latest of my million swing thoughts, but I think this is it…for me. I love swing crack.

    Reply
    • Jim D

      A friend who is a phys ed teacher and softball coach but not a golfer calls this move “squash the bug”.

      Reply
      • Mega

        Was taught squash the bug in baseball decades ago and when I came back to golf after a 3 year layoff I got a lesson to get ready for a charity scramble event, my pro used squash the bug with me. Drove the ball great and got the bug again to start playing golf. That was 3 years ago.

        Reply
  4. Martyn Birch

    I think coming back to this idea is a big key for me. Gone from slicing my driver through straight now starting to hook despite trying different grip strengths. Come to the conclusion that my upper body is lurching forward and that is causing the hook.

    I struggle also with getting hands forward. Swing thought at the minute is keep my head behind the ball, this in turn allows my shoulders to be tilted at impact and of course leads to spine tilt also. This also allows room for arms and hands to be forward, does this make sense?

    Reply
  5. Kip

    Ok so at address is your weight neutral on your feet maybe favoring the left side a little with tilt away from the target? with the “secondary tilt” at impact is your weight back to neutral with both feet solidly on the ground? In the follow through more weight will shift to the left foot? I have the tendency to slide left to get my weight to the left side instead of rotating and tilting, it almost feels like I’m falling backward if I tilt and will put more weight back on the right side.

    Reply
    • nick hanson

      When you add secondary tilt you don’t actually have to “reposition” your weight in your feet. If you bump your hips a bit (moving the weight slightly forward) your head should move back which will counterbalance that hip bump. This video gets into it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBuUe7EwQOU

      Reply
        • e401k

          So I am a “hip thrusting”, “overally in to out path” early extender and I am committed to rid myself of this curse…

          after I have added adequate tilt at address and maintained it to the top of the backswing all hell breaks loose.

          eliminating the hip thrust EE at 100mph is next impossible. Your youtube vids have helped me diagnose this problem; now…

          how do you suggest training it out of the swing?

          what does the practice of one of your students who is fixing this fatal flaw consist of?

          in short I’m certain I know what’s wrong, I believe I know how to do it correctly (at a snails pace), but how do I make it a habit at full speed?

          Reply
          • Monte Scheinblum

            Somehow steepening the shaft in transition. Need to fix that.

Leave a Reply

Share This
X